Oct 17, 2008, Multiply, The Debate, McCain and his remarks

I keep hearing my self say this is not my problem, not my argument, not my debate…………………

WELL HELLO ………………..LOOK WHO JUST MADE IT MY DEBATE……………..

McCain: “Senator Obama wants to set up health care bureaucracies, take over the health care of America through -- as he said, his object is a single payer system. If you like that, you'll love Canada and England.

Before I rant about this man I need to clear up a technicality, Mr McCain, if you are hoping to be president of the most powerful country on earth maybe you should learn to get your political terminology correct. When you quoted ‘Canada and England’ I suspect you actually meant Canada and the UK. I can’t believe I need to spell this out to a presidential candidate, but for the record ;…. The UK consists of England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland. If you want to discuss, or even briefly mention, the health service of the UK it is inappropriate to address those remarks to or about ‘England’, this is a mistake of the politically inept and ignorant.

ONTO HIS OFFENSIVE REMARK.

I don’t know where to begin, how dare this man deride a health care system that provides unlimited health care, free at the point of delivery, to every man woman and child in the country? The provision of health care in this country, even the most pioneering and expensive health care, is allocated on the basis of medical need not on how good your insurance is or what your level of cover is. Or If Mr McCain had his way, if your employer decided to provide adequate health care cover.

I have a very dear friend who suffers the most terrible ill health. To my knowledge she has had two lots of open heart surgery and at least one other very new experimental heart procedure. She has had years and years of treatment for rheumatoid arthritis, thyroid malfunction and a whole host of other medical problems. At no time during her years of illness was she ever asked demeaning questions about her financial situation or the limits of her health care cover. On the occasions when an ambulance was needed, one was called, arrived fairly quickly, and with out asking her who her insurance company was or sending her a bill, transported her as quickly and efficiently as possible to the world famous Ninewells Teaching hospital, Dundee. Here she received first class treatment which was FREE AT THE POINT OF DELIVERY. I have a horrible feeling if she lived under Mr McCain’s system she would no longer be with us; financially she is quite a poor woman who is unable to work.

I have arthritis; it was diagnosed a few years ago and is progressively getting worse. Over the last few years I have had, GP appointments, orthopaedic appointments,  ex-rays, physiotherapy and minor surgery all of which were provided under The National Health Service, again ‘FREE AT THE POINT OF DELIVERY’. The hospitals I have been fortunate enough to attend have, with out exception, been clean efficient and staffed by experienced professionally qualified doctors and nurses. I  have been offered  knee  replacement surgery as soon as I feel ready  to accept major surgery. All I need do is ask to be referred back to the surgeon.  My medical needs are assessed, thats is all, there is no other criteria.

Two of my grandchildren have spent time in special care baby units, they are quite well now but they had infant pneumonia when they were tiny babies, one when he was just a week old and the other just a week before his first birthday. These units are staffed with nurses who have specialist post graduate qualifications way beyond their first nursing degree. The ratio of nurse /patient is very, very high. At the change over of nursing shift the nurse in charge of my grandchild would make her self known to his mother so she knew who was responsible for her child at all times.  I don’t think these children would get any better care any where else in the world. Do I need to say it again?? ‘FREE AT THE POINT OF DELIVERY’’

I could go on, and on, but don’t worry I won’t. I’m not going to bore you with my niece and her ears, of my nephew and his stomach or my sister who has celiac disease, or my daughter who had childhood asthma and eczema, or the child at school who fell during a football match (the ambulance arrived within minutes of being called).   

I don’t deny we have problems in health care, every health care system has problems. Sure sometimes you need to wait a little while, and sometimes the hospitals are short of cash, and sometimes charities donate equipment but these are problems experienced by any system attempting to provide good health care. But I absolutely and with out reservation believe our National Health Service is among the best in the world. I don’t know any thing about Canada’s health care system but for it to be lumped together with ours I suspect it is good.

So Mr McCain, I repeat….how bloody dare you insult something your people can only dream of.

delete reply brendainmad wrote on Oct 19, '08 I'm glad Had read you post, Loretta. She wrote one on politics too although that's not what she usually blogs about. Hers is very interesting too - not that the politicians would care. Hope you're having a good Sunday.

delete reply hadenough1 wrote on Oct 19, '08, edited on Oct 19, '08 It's a shame, a basic need for life and a country like ours can not make it obtainable so all can get the care they need. Shame on McCain It's not just McCain though. Its all the lies we have been told for so long. Its the sidestepping we do rather than confront this wrong. It's greed and selfishness. I wish it were just one. But it is not. A few States like have added a national State wide plan (very few) and that is a start. I hope more will and take from those who keep trying to stop it. My Senator from Illinois although he gives a fine speech as he is running for President--he is a good talker--in all the time he has been there-- We can't move such a bill here. We have many Vet here--and homeless in the very city he is at. Our taxes are now one of the highest as high as many in California. I have questions for My Jr. State Senator Mr. Obama too---if you couldn't make the changes here -how do you plan to do it in a whole country? I don't like either of these men, Brenda ask me to come to your blog-so I hope you are not offended by what I have to say. I don't mean to offend you personally/ But I know another man who is not what he appears. And I do know him personally. I know how he acts--how he lives--what he drives-I have talk him. He has lied to my face on issues, than tried to charm me with his charm (yes) than tried to weasel out of things. I don't usually do potilcal blogs but I just did on my page too. Which is where Brenda asks me to see yours I have friends in other countries--at least they have these basic--and I'm glad they do. If we were to line up all who died from lack of care here--it would amaze people. Everyday and in every city someone dies from lack of care. If they were dogs dying in those numbers --there would be public outcry. You see we allow emergency treatment but you might not be able to afford the heart medicine to prevent a heart attack so you might die before you get to the hospital when you have one. A good barker doesn't make a good dog anymore than a good speaker makes a good man. Maybe someday we will have a leader who I can be proud of but you won't hear praise from my lips from the choices I have been given for office of the President.

delete reply elizelizeliz wrote on Oct 19, '08 I AM TINKIN HAOW AMRIKANS FRITN OF COMUNIME & SOZIALISME & HAOW THAY TINKIN TIS TING THAY CALLIN SOZIALIS MEDIZIN IS VARI LIK HEREIN SOZIALISTE MEDIZIN. SO IS HAOW AMRIKAN POLITIKOS IS FRITININ OTHAR PESSONS BY MAKIN THAM TINKIN HAOW THAY GOIN BECOMIN GOVANMANTE KONTROLLTE LIK IN ROSSIYA. THAN IS THAY GOIN NO GIVIN VOT 4 PESSON WHU IS GOIN MAKIN HELT FREI.

delete reply nemo4sun wrote on Oct 18, '08 this is one of the most interesting discussions i have read on the net :)

delete reply edtrain5 wrote on Oct 17, '08 Hello Loretta... Many thanks for your well-motivated comments. Your comments are well taken. I would mention that the private insurers are a multi-billion/trillion dollar business. As are the hospitals, the MD's and the pharmaceutical companies. They will not go happily into universal coverage... it will mean immense financial losses to them and they will lobby with all their might to retain the status quo. After reading your comments and those of the responders, I'm in favor of a Universal Health Care system. It's overdue in this country. Lincoln's concluding words in the Gettysburg address were, "... that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth." Somewhere we have lost this vision. This translates to meaning that government should be focused upon the population as a whole, the people of this nation. Not upon the many special interests in this country. The special interests that Lincoln and that you speak of here are the entire population of our fine country. Everyone. Let us hope and pray that whomever wins the election will take this matter seriously and move it forward. It may not be the most pressing problem at the moment but it is a long-standing one and our private health care system is not working. Too many people in the USA have NO coverage. Many more have only minimal coverage and many of them must pay horrible premiums for their "poor" coverage. My deep thanks to you and to all who have responded from the US as well as from other countries. All of you represent a good cross section of the US and Europe. Peace and blessings, Ed #################

edit delete reply forgetmenot525 wrote on Oct 17, '08 philsgal7759 said As you may know my husband died of colon cancer. I think he had good care but we had insurance. I believe he died because his disease was simply beyond the power of medicine to cure. I think you are right, my Father died of cancer of the throat and it was a horrible disease. He died despite the best care because the cancer could not be cured not because of lack of care. What you say about people not being able to go to a doctor because they can't afford it is barbaric in this day and age.

edit delete reply forgetmenot525 wrote on Oct 17, '08 octoberwitch said And yes I only dream of your healthcare system!! Hopefully soon its a reality. Thank you...like I said, same as any other health care system it has its problems but its better than an insurance let system. At The moment America seems to be the only country in the west that doesn't have a universal health care system, maybe that is about to change

delete reply octoberwitch wrote on Oct 17, '08 Oh, and this; my 23 year old daughter has no means to get any health care and has suffered with a toothache for months. I took her to the hospital emergency room for it once and she has a bill now she cannot pay and still has the tooth, hurting, making her go to bed for days.

delete reply octoberwitch wrote on Oct 17, '08 Its nice to see the whole world cares more about our health care than our own conservative countrymen do. You should hear what I hear everyday from average people and their health care woes, going for a simple check up is impossible for many people and if you have an unexpected health issue youre basically broke and it ruins your credit.

delete reply acousticeagle wrote on Oct 17, '08, edited on Oct 17, '08 We Aussies, like the UK and Canada have a wonderful medicare system. I was only in hospital recently and due to my financial situation I didn't have to pay anything. Cheers to your comments, Loretta. McCain is trying to scare the Americans into thinking that Obama wants to bring in socialism. This is just praying on people's fears. Has anyone seen that documentary movie about the American health care system? People are suffering. But it's all about money, isn't it? As long as big corporations can make money out of health insurance, why should they care. When Obama said he was going to reform the health care system in the USA I was all for him, and if I was American, he'd sure get my vote.

Comment deleted at the request of the author.

delete reply djdx wrote on Oct 17, '08 The system is pretty good here in France also. I really appreciated it when my boys were small, if they had anything wrong, I could just go to the doctor, whereas my sister in the States had to calculate if her child was sick enough to spend the money. I heard a news report on the French radio, the announcer said such and such a candidate was called "socialist" and, she explained, over there that's an insult. I didn't realize about UK and England until I was living here in France.

edit delete reply forgetmenot525 wrote on Oct 17, '08 starfishred said in america-my daughter pays 555.dollars a monthe cause she has an under active thyroid I'm so sorry about your daughter, My friend who I share an office with at work has the same problem and I don't know how she would cope if she had to worry about medical bills. Her mother has been fighting cancer for the last two years and my friend is aware of how fortunate we are to have the NHS, there is no way she could pay medical bills for her mother and for herself. Yes, from what I have been told Canada seems to have an excellent health service

delete reply brendainmad wrote on Oct 17, '08 Bravo, Loretta! If only there were a way to distribute your letter so that all Americans could read your blog. I wouldn't send a copy to McCain because he would just pass it to their Joe the plumber (no insult meant towards poor Joe. He works to earn a living). I'm sure the same is true in the UK as in Spain and that is that no one is refused medical treatment even if they're not contributing to the system. Not so in the US. There people leave hospital before they should because they just can't afford it because either they don't have insurance or their insurance doesn't cover such an extended stay. McCain married money so he has nothing to worry about. I don't usually blog about politics but that's definitely part of what I'm going to write about this weekend. Thank you so much for writing this.

delete reply wickedlyinnocent wrote on Oct 17, '08 Our healthcare system is like yours, Loretta, and lots of other countries in Europe have a similar one too. When I decided to switch from the private hospital to the national health service I was a bit worried, but I have nothing to complain about and I haven't paid a cent. The hospital is as good as the private ones , the staff and treatments are 5 stars. The problem is the waiting lists for surgery, unless you need urgent surgery you will have to wait, and now it seems things will get a bit complicated because we lack lots of specialists and surgeons, it's extremely difficult to be accepted at medical school, so students prefer to go to Spain and then they won't come back. One good thing in the European Union is you can be treated in any other country, a good way of avoiding the lists.

delete reply philsgal7759 wrote on Oct 17, '08, edited on Oct 17, '08 when we first began to talk about adopting the European and Canadian (because isn't most of Europe on a similar system to the UK?) Anyway, I had thought that maybe it would be worse maybe we would have worse health care without the private insurers. Well it's been about 16-20 years since then and a lot has happened I see people neglect their health because it might raise their premiums or bankrupt them. As you may know my husband died of colon cancer. I think he had good care but we had insurance. I believe he died because his disease was simply beyond the power of medicine to cure. But there are others who won't get medical tests or surgery that could save their lives and when you talk to them and beg them to go get test and treatments and surgery they tell you they can't afford it. Some Americans have to choose between clothes and rent and physical and mental health. And I am tired of seeing friends family either suffer or pay exorbitant premiums to gert the care they need and deserve Life is way too precious to play this political game

delete reply aimlessjoys wrote on Oct 17, '08 Thank you, Loretta! I am praying with every fiber of my being that the election results will prove that US citizens can spot a phony & know a good thing when they see it. The long, drawn-out democratic primaries & these horrendous campaign shenanigans are wearing us all to a frazzle. I used to wonder who could be worse than George W. Bush. Now I know, & it could be raining, lol! Please keep a good thought turning during our struggles with ignorance, greed, ambition & fear. We need all the good thoughts & friendly support we can get!

delete reply octoberwitch wrote on Oct 17, '08 And yes I only dream of your healthcare system!! Hopefully soon its a reality.

delete reply octoberwitch wrote on Oct 17, '08, edited on Oct 17, '08 Loretta you are right on and Im hoping the polls are showing the truth and the people here in the USA are ready to change some things. We have no health care here unless youre really rich or really poor. Ive been poor, raised kids on my own and we had state medical. That in itself was a shame and it pays less than the prices they charge jacked up insurances so generally you ran the risk of being treated like a low life. My best friend since high school works 2 jobs, has a mortgage and a car payment and an 8 yr old child still at home. She is my age, 51 and suffers from numerous ailments and aches and pains, yet the system deems her too wealthy to have state medical. (she is not, she can not afford to ever go to the Dr.)They allow the child to have it but not the mother. Does that make sense? The mother that must work 2 jobs cant keep healthy for her son. I know that someday she will collapse and not be able to work, and all her health issues will be so bad they will take 1000s of dollars to fix as she has never had an ounce of preventative care. Yet here we sit in this supposedly great nation with millions of people suffering like my friend, with a bunch of citizens that call federal health care socialism, communism etc. Well they dont mind having socialized police, fire department, government and schools do they? But the republicans like John McCain instill fear to turn our medical needs to the government. Its really sad and insane, and it is literally causing the death of our society. They like to use our own government in a derogatory way when they speak of health care, saying things like, "Do you really want THEM running your healthcare?" Well I say YES, many would like that rather than the alternative of NONE. Bill Mahr, who is hated by the conservatives said, (and Im paraphrasing) how would you like it if when the fire department showed up to put the fire out in your house; they asked you to write a check first? How would we like it if you were robbed and you called to a near by policeman and he said, that will be $100 dollars? Why is the human right of medical care not treated with the same urgency and care as the needs for a fire department and a police force?? You tell me world, why is my country so F-ed up?? (....old stale puritan ethics clinging on to the bitter end perhaps, with biblical connections???) Obama/Biden 08

delete reply bennett1 wrote on Oct 17, '08 I remember in the 8th grade, the US was trying to get some sort of universal health care. The Republicans kept calling it "socialized medicine" as if that was the most horrible thing that could be. Doctors spent millions to sabotage it as did doctors and pharmaceutical companies spend millions to sabotage the Clintons' efforts to overhaul health care. If you want to do away with an idea over here, call it "socialism" and everyone will run for the hills.

delete reply tammidee wrote on Oct 17, '08 Thank you for setting the record straight. The Republicans always lie about this and try to scare us by tying it to Communism in some way. Peace and love, Tammi Dee xxx

edit delete reply forgetmenot525 wrote on Oct 17, '08 bennett1 said I have made the mistake of referring to the entire UK as England, and have no problem with having it clarified. But, in McCain Thats OK, don't worry about it, that is my point, here is a man who hopes to be president of America and he can't even get the name right of the country supposed to be his biggest international friend !!! like I said, a mistake like that from a man in his position is politically inept and ignorant. AND..............It is part of the reason so many ordinary folk do the same thing, he sets a bad example. .

delete reply starfishred wrote on Oct 17, '08 thanks loretta-I lived in Canada for5 yrs. and we never had to worry about health care or dental care but not in america-my daughter pays 555.dollars a monthe cause she has an under active thyroid so no one will giver anything cheaper and she still has a very big copayment and all this out of her own pocket sad isn't it.

delete reply bennett1 wrote on Oct 17, '08 I have made the mistake of referring to the entire UK as England, and have no problem with having it clarified. But, in McCain, we are talking about someone who wishes to make policies that would affect the entire world and HE is ignorant. Or doesn't care. He embarrasses me. But then the US knows so little about itself. People cannot name or place many of the states. Periodic tests show that young and old have an appalling lack of knowledge of geography of their own country as well as history. And as for world geography, Americans are so self-centered that they care little about that.

edit delete reply forgetmenot525 wrote on Oct 17, '08 hedgewitch9 said And yes, I am bored with Britain being called England too! :P If America was called New York, or Texas only, for example, I am sure that it would be noticed and corrected! :))) ahhhhh fellow Celt I knew you would understand.............I make this point at every possible opportunity........it is so wrong. Yes you are right, this American debate has shown us how very fortunate we are and how excellent our NHS really is

delete reply hedgewitch9 wrote on Oct 17, '08 *********Standing ovation for Loretta********** Your points re: health system are excellent!! Sometimes it is slow and sometimes we need to nag certain doctors, but we are so very fortunate!!! And yes, I am bored with Britain being called England too! :P If America was called New York, or Texas only, for example, I am sure that it would be noticed and corrected! :)))

edit delete reply forgetmenot525 wrote on Oct 17, '08 bennett1 said Canada has an excellent health care system. I know a woman with cancer who does not need to worry about the bills. On the other hand, we are still, now, weeks after my mother-in-laws death, still dealing with bills. Sometimes we need to take a step back and realise how lucky we are, too often here people criticize the NHS, we are so lucky, I cannot imagine how it must be to be gravely ill AND worry how to pay for treatment, in my mind that is barbaric. Awwww ok.... you keep him, guess you do need him

delete reply bennett1 wrote on Oct 17, '08 Canada has an excellent health care system. I know a woman with cancer who does not need to worry about the bills. On the other hand, we are still, now, weeks after my mother-in-laws death, still dealing with bills. I am not so charitable, we need Obama, we need him badly. Even if he doesn't win.

edit delete reply forgetmenot525 wrote on Oct 17, '08 bennett1 said Loretta, if you are a praying person, pray. Hopefully his horrid ideas will be toast after the election. And Bennett, If you are a charitable person, if you don't want Obama, give him to us....:)

delete reply bennett1 wrote on Oct 17, '08 Loretta, if you are a praying person, pray. Hopefully his horrid ideas will be toast after the election.